Cenarius
Adds will spawn that you can choose to cleanse, and thus transforming them to help you, or leave them be and deal with them.
Stage One
Malfurion Stormrage - Cleansing Ground ; Cleansed Ground. ---Idea is to come in and cleanse Creeping Nightmares buff when it gets too high. Can get 20-30 stacks maybe before you need to cleanse (Will discover once we see it)
Cenarius
- Creeping Nightmares
- Nightmare Brambles -(Drops Brambles every 2 seconds ; Coming in contact with them will root and inflict shadow damage every 2 seconds) ---Kite away from the raid. Can be dispelled if caught by them.
- Aura of Dread Thorns - (20 yds Norm / 30yrd Heroic/Mythic) --- Tank everything as far away from the boss as possible. Will apply to himself, so watch when you have to stop damaging him.
- Forces of Nightmare - Calling the Forces of Nightmare to aid Cenarius. If not cleansed, and Ally of Nightmare will spawn after 10 seconds. ***Mythic - Existing Allies of Nature are corrupted by Cenarius and fall to the Nightmare, assaulting all nearby players.
- ***Mythic - Nightmare Blast
__________________________________________________________________________
Forces of Nightmare - summons 3 out of the 4 each time casted.
Corrupted Wisp (tree when dormant)- travel towards target with highest threat. --- Should be killed asap - Md them to tanks. If debuff stacks are getting too high we can activate the good wisps to spawn green patches to help cleanse it off.
Nightmare Ancient -
- Desiccating Stomp (Desiccation)--- Make sure at least one person is in it. The more the better. (Do not take brambles in there with you) *** Mythic - Will cast this twice in succession.
Rotten Drake - (large egg when dormant)
- Rotten Breath - Picks the direction of a random player; 4 second breath. Any player in front takes damage. --- Move out of the breath.
- Nightmare Buffet ---Switch to this drake when its low hp.
Twisted Sister - (Little butterflies when dormant) -
- Nightmare Javelin - Can be dispelled but healers may not have spare time/gcd to do it often.
- Twisted Touch of Life --- HAS to be interrupted
- Scorned Touch - Can not be dispelled --- Make sure you spread with this.
Should we chose to cleanse these adds (by having the most people stand next to them for the cleanse), this is how each will benefit the raid:
Allies of Nature :
Wisp - Cleansing Detonate & Cleansed Ground. If de-buff is getting too high.
Cleansed Ancient - Replenishing Roots - If healers need mana.
Emerald Drake - Ancient Dream - Buff for the tank.
Redeemed Sister - Unbound Touch - Use this to clear bramble patches
_____________________________________________________________
Stage 2 - No more aura
Cenarius
Spear of Nightmares - Size of puddle based on how much damage you take. ---Active mitigation and tank swap.
Nightmare Brambles - (Drops Brambles every 2 seconds ; Coming in contact with them will root and inflict shadow damage every 2 seconds) --- Continue to kite them away from the raid.
Entangling Nightmares --- Need to switch DPS to these immediately to allow Malfurion to continue casting Cleansing Ground for the raid.
Malfurion
Cleansing Ground - Will be interrupted by entangling roots. --- DPS entangling roots down asap.
6
NOTE for Phase2 :
Cenarius
Spear of Nightmares - Size of puddle based on how much damage you take. ---Active mitigation and tank swap. This is what the ground was getting covered in! :) Easy fix :) ***
Entangling Nightmares --- Need to switch DPS to these immediately to allow Malfurion to continue casting Cleansing Ground for the raid.
Malfurion
Cleansing Ground - Will be interrupted by entangling roots. --- DPS entangling roots down asap.
Last edited by *~Lily~* on Mon Oct 03, 2016 3:10 pm; edited 2 times in total
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=syoEX2DE2go
Rogues, Turtle hunters, Pally bubble to clear roots.
Everyone stack around the choice that we pick for a cleansed add. Clear de-buff with green then get out.
1st set of adds:
***Wisp (top left/NE area) / tree / dragon - spawn cleansed ground
Kill tree and drake. Stand on the tree to soak stomp. Get out of breath from the drake. After 50% focus on him, pusating. Stack the adds - kill drake, then tree.
2nd set of adds:
***Wisp / Dragon / Sisters
Dispel dot, Interupt Twisted touch of life, scorned touch. Kill sister 1st, then dragon - burst after 50%
3rd set of adds:
***Tree / Sister / Sister
Mana back for heals, stand under tree. Kill one sister at a time and interrupt heals.
4th Set of adds:
***Wisp / Dragon / Dragon
Kill ONE dragon at a time, NO cleave.
***35% health - no adds up and no brand new as hes spawning. (can lust to transition if close). If you don't push by next adds;
4th Set of adds:
***Tree / Tree / Sister
Stack under tree (run out if you get scorned touch), kill sister first with interrupts.
Phase 2
No more adds. But have nightmare brambles. Still ticking damage and de-buff. Placing cleansed ground on largest clump of players.
Free the roots on malfuirion. All ranged swap to them.
Spear of Nightmares - More damage you take the bigger the pool will be that spawns. - externals in rotation.
Slowly move him around the room, as to not run out of space.
Lust at 35%. Healing Cd's for Tree Stomp /Dragons breath.
MYTHIC
Changes
~ Any adds that you cleanse will become evil at the end of the add wave.
~ We will be 3 tanking.
~ Tank all dragons in the far corner, and leave them up on Inx, with Mccrip (Thorns won't target him) healing him.
______________________________________________________________________________________
Brambles is key in this fight. NO ONE should ever get caught on them. Everyone should watch roots when they spawn, move away, see who they are going to, and that person kite it to a non-busy area.
----Rogues, Pally, Hunters, Shadow priest (blessing of freedom with a class with a high damage reduction) --- assign and call on the fly to clear asap. Rogues as outlaw (damage might be less) but rolling bones into cdr buff this will help reduce CD on cloak. And combining cloak with grappling hook you can clear a ton)
______________________________________________________________________________________
*** Lust on the pull - healers pot and dps, and drag Cenarius to the Wisps.
Nightmare Blast- Tanks face him away from the group. The 2 non-drake tanks will taunt on 2.
*** First thorns come in - keep attacking boss. Cleanse wisps and keep resetting your stacks, then ranged spread lightly for next roots.
Add Waves:
1. Drake & Tree spawn -
~ 3rd tank picks up drake and tanks it in the corner of the room (along with assigned healer), and stay there the rest of the fight.
~2nd tank, taunt tree over and tank it under the boss. DPS switch and cleave to the boss. *** Should still have lust up, so aoe heals and spot heal.
~ See who has the roots, and see that they kite away from the group. Once you see this, stack under tree for the stomp. Stomp does 2 stomps, 2nd one doing more damage. HEALER CD: SLT + Tranq
~ After stomp is out, spread out around the boss, kill off the tree, and kite roots around, clear brambles, and clear stacks from wisp patches.
****Want Cenarius around 60% and all players to reset their stacks. ***Drake tank will need to reset - time it just after a breath.
2. Sister & Drake
~ Cenarius, tank, melee dps stay on new wisp tree to cleanse it, while ranged dps and OT get ready to kill old set of wisps. As he casts Force of Nature, each set of 5 green pools will make 1 bad wisp. Kill wisps staggered; each time they die they do aoe damage to raid. Can do 3 at a time with a CD, then last 2 one at a time. Can MD all wisps to tank and slow and stun them. HEALER CD with 3 at a time: SLT & HTT.
~ Drake tank picks up Drake and keeps him in the corner.
~ Interrupt Sister heal much more often. ***Assign 2-3 interrupt rotation. Scorned touch goes to many more player and slows you more. *** Pre-spread out. Set up pre-assigned locations for melee to spread out for this.
~ Try not to kills wisps as scorned touch is going out. Healers watch multi-dotting classes, since they will be getting the damage from the dread roots reflection.
~ Brambles - make sure you don't take into melee and clean them up frequently.
~ Kill off sister and aim for Cenarius at 40%, and move him over to the tree. EVERYONE needs to cleanse here.
3. Sister & Sister
~ Kill off the 3 old wisps, and then last 2. HEALER CD: AM & HTT
~ Pre-spread for sisters, as almost everyone will get a scorned touch.
~ Mark one and 2nd pot all CD's.
~ Brambles --- Keep them AWAY from the tree, because healers need to get that mana back. (If they end up under the tree - clear them asap)
~ Finish off sisters, highest stacked players use the pool (not everyone will be able to clear).
~ Phase 2 @ 35% health - if we can push transition, before next add wave, do so. (If SPriest needs to pop Surrender to madness early to get us there, then they should) (Going into Phase 2 with only 2 drakes up is ideal)
~ Next wave, cleanse wisp.
4. Drake & Drake
~ Kill off the tree. Tank it under the boss (if we have lots of damage to catch up on), and cleave it down. If we are close to pushing, tank it away. Repeat tactics from first set; watch brambles,kite away, then go stack for stomp.
~ Cleanse stacks before transition.
PHASE 2
~ No more nightmare blast ability, but instead spear of nightmare. You can BoP, but needs to be place during the cast, NOT before. Have Cd's lined up for SoN.
~ Brambles are more often - kite them away from melee, and clear as much as possible.
Beasts of Nightmare - side step it. Can spawn on tanks/melee. (Sucks to be you... :P)
~ Kill brambles on Cenarius only once OR twice.... drop it when close to death.
~ Drake tank needs to mirror movement of the tanks and Cenarius, making sure there is always the largest gap between the raid and the drakes for the breath. Stacks will be crazy high at the end (since this tank/healer cant reset them) so save some Cd's for this end phase. (When the stacks start to get to 100 we can send over a 2nd healer to help)
_______________________________________________________________________________
NOTE
LUST --> Cen to wisps
1. Cleanse Wisp. Drake to back. Kill Tree - stack AFTER thorns kited out.
CD: SLT & Tranq. Spread after stomp. CLEAR STACKS. (60%?)
2. Cleanse WispTree. Drake to Back. Sister - Interupts: 1. Wasa 2. Morrine 3. Yasu
Kill old wisps; CD: SLT & HTT. Pre-spread for sisters. (Melee assigned directions)
EVERYONE CLEANSE (40%?)
3. Cleanse Tree. Kill Sister & Sister.
Old Wisps; CD AM & HTT. Pre-spread, mark one, interrupts.
KEEP brambles AWAY from tree.
PHASE 2 @ 35% - push if we can before adds.
4. Cleanse Wisps. Drake & Drake to the back.
Kill off old Tree (Stack it under boss if we are really behind)
Cleanse before transition.
P2: Move out of Beasts of Nightmare.
Kill brambles on Cenarius up to 10% or so.
Last edited by *~Lily~* on Thu Dec 22, 2016 1:37 am; edited 4 times in total
There are 4 different strategies for this encounter - but this was the first one I really looked at. I talked to some 7/7M RL's who gave me a little insight as well.
Apparently there is a burn strategy as well, but I wasn't sure if we could pull that off, and looking at our logs they didn't think our dps was enough either. It could be different with so much multi-targeting though - most people look at Ursoc.
Anyway, I am working on 1 hour of sleep last night, and only 2 the night before. It's safe to say I'm a mess and won't have time to do further research for this until I catch up on things.
I am open and welcome additional input/suggestions.
Ideas -
Blood tank to mass grip the wisps (proly only get 3). Don't stack but use tranq or HTT.
For sister, can put 3 ST melee on Cenarius, like Kera, eiri, and jok and they can take left right and back (tank in the front) which will decongest the area for scorned touch on sister... but dps has to be great to get them down fast.
I'm not sure how the zerg strategy is different than the normal strategy, other than just doing more dps. In both cases the ancient is stacked with the boss, we are getting thorn damage, and the drakes don't die.
Some notes:
- Inx might not need heals for single drake. This means McCrip can help with raid.
- The Twisted Sister can be stacked with the boss after the second scorned touch cast.
- Tanks can easily take 2 nightmare blasts if needed.
- Healers dps the boss at the start.
- I can clear brambles every 1.5 minutes, saving some dps down time. I'm not sure about timing yet. Certainly in phase 2 I can.
- We may be able to have ranged come in for the Ancient stops (there are two) after the bramble target is known.
- Ranged only use small patches to cleanse. This keeps the melee patch longer and reduces melee movement.
Some good information here:
http://www.icy-veins.com/wow/cenarius-mythic-strategy-tactics
Last edited by Headcloud on Tue Dec 27, 2016 11:38 pm; edited 1 time in total
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVKzpYft6HY
Wisps @ 4:20, 5:35, & 13:10 - Looks like they are hunter cc'ing 1 or 2 of them, and marking the other 3 to burst down, with MD's to the tank - on the 3rd one, you can see the bear tank do a push back when the wisps get to him.
I am sure there are more videos on these, but I think for sure we need to have better control of the wisps especially if they are up and running around still when the sister is up. Imagine if one aggros someone in melee and explodes in the group. Last night TGH got eaten by one while working on the sister.
Some notes interpreted from Icy Veins:
Add spawn:
Left: Ancient + Drake
Left: Wisps + Drake + Sister
Right: Wisps + Two Sisters
Tank Rotation
1. Grump
2. Serret (Nightmare Ancient about to die)
3. Serret (shortly after second cast of Forces of Nightmare Icon Forces of Nightmare; Boss Tank must taunt immediately and Add Tank must run to get the newly spawned Twisted Sister)
4. Grump (after having dragged boss to the top right corner)
5. Serret (after killing the Twisted Sister)
6. Grump (while the two Twisted Sisters are up)
7. Grump (shortly before or after killing the two Twisted Sister and right before pushing the boss to Phase 2)
8. Serret taunts the boss to handle the first Spear of Nightmares Icon Spear of Nightmares in Phase Two
Bramble Rotation
1. Jeeg
2. Ash
3. Serret/Zap
4. Jeeg
5. Cruelton
6. Eiri
7. Jeeg
Phase Two: whoever can
Videos:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkLMcK1Ic9k
In this video they only have two add waves. They seem to stun the wisps and kill them without any particular order. They die quickly. 6 million HP each.
They use a gateway for drake healer.
They stack the sister for cleave. The raid just spreads for the two scorned touch casts.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLE7EizUHNk
Similar strategy. Hunter uses binding shot on whisps.
Zerg Strategy - I assume this is the one you saw Serret?
Mccrip - check out 6min 20 sec into the video :)
We can try Suiqe dpsing and try to push again before the 3rd set of adds spawns.
Additionally, lets have Inx tank the dragon in the bottom right corner so he is further away from the boos/raid on a diagonal. Just have to be careful when the sister spawns in that corner. Tank will need to pull her up to the right-hand front side, where we would normally stand for the tree cleansing. After the 2nd scorned touch, we can take her to the boss, and dragging her across the front of the room should leave a clear path without brambles, because ranged should not be standing or kiting them there.
I was talking to a friend today who is 7/7 and this is the strat they use as well. Is there anyone besides Serret that can tank this? Losing his dps hurts. Same with having Jeeg go Outlaw. We're losing a ton of dps by having those 2 shift roles.
Well having jeeg outlaw lets him clear brambles at an amazing rate - which gives everyone else more damage uptime and less confusion pulling more players out to do it.
Morrine or Wasatch are the other tanks. They both already do great damage as well.
We will have Eiri back this week as well.
We will see how it goes. I'm gonna set it all up, and have healers pot and go all out with these changes, and see where we end up after 2-3 pulls. I think we will hit it.
Note: I wrote this before some of the recent comments
Problems
Bramble damage
Warped, Suiqe, Lewda, and Lily should all try to avoid brambles better. Much of the other Bramble damage is intentional from clearing.
Creeping Nightmares
Some people are building stacks too high, some are clearing too much. Sweet spot is 20. Here are a couple examples:
Replay of last attempt
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/qF9gZ1HAy67jYBwG#fight=31&view=replay
Lily got too close to Drake and died from breath. Should the Drake be in the further corner (bottom left in replay view)?
Damage to Wisps
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/qF9gZ1HAy67jYBwG#type=damage-done&fight=31&target=76
Warped and Cyndaquil need to increase damage to Wisps. Ideally there is no melee damage to Wisps.
Here is people getting hit by Wisps:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/qF9gZ1HAy67jYBwG#type=damage-taken&fight=31&ability=210619
The damage from that is about 20% of the blow up damage:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/qF9gZ1HAy67jYBwG#type=damage-taken&fight=31&ability=226713
If a Wisp is going to hit you, try to be 8 yards from everyone else. I now think the add tank can help by getting wisp aggro away from the group. A tank can soak these just fine and reduce movement of everyone else. Add tank needs a marker.
Damage to Cenarius
Here is a damage log from one of our longer attempts:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/qF9gZ1HAy67jYBwG#type=damage-done&target=44&fight=31
I don't think this is terribly useful because people are dying. I would like to see an attempt where everyone stays alive until the pair of sisters comes out. However, it feels like damage to Cenarius is too low. One area for DPS to optimize is using CDs/potions when thorns are down.